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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19077
Location: PDX9/21/22 2:30 PM |
Glue is glue and heat softens it. I can remove a glued fretboard with my heat gun that was in theory one piece to the wood it was glued to. I can also burn it with the heat gun I have. ;O
In my minds eye you have two glue layers instead of one with the tape. One on each side, facing rim and facing base tape. Does it mean higher probability of rolling VS brushed on mastic? I think it is a good question, I'd lean maybe. ;)
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RCoapman
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 5141
Location: Back in the snowy homeland9/21/22 2:48 PM |
Well...if each layer of glue/tape has the same adhesion as just glue, I would think the shearing force of an identical lean would be halved for each of those layers as you have the same forces involved but two glue interfaces with, presumably, each having the same adhesion as the single one.
Obviously, if you separate either layer the effect is the same- road rash and a lot of expensive parts to be bought but if tape disperses that lateral force between the two layers, that's a huge selling point.
But AP physics was a long time ago and I can't really say that's how this works.
I figured the heat would be the same, I like to think and guess out loud...even with my fingers
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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19077
Location: PDX9/21/22 3:41 PM |
Ever have a sammy with mayo on both sides?
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PLee
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 3712
Location: Brooklyn, NY9/21/22 5:38 PM |
Long downhills not only got my rims overheated, they also melted brake pads . . .
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RCoapman
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 5141
Location: Back in the snowy homeland9/21/22 6:32 PM |
quote:
Ever have a sammy with mayo on both sides?
I would consider mayo more of a lubricant vs an adhesive. Not sure that apple compares to that orange. ;)
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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19077
Location: PDX9/21/22 8:21 PM |
When that glue gets hot enough it is like lube.
Now not related, but anyone see Van Vleutens front tubeless tire come off team TT World Championships?
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RCoapman
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 5141
Location: Back in the snowy homeland9/22/22 3:35 AM |
Oh, I'd agreed on the heat and left that point several posts ago. I was just talking about normal temp glue with tape or traditional application.
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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19077
Location: PDX9/22/22 9:59 AM |
I have zero experience with the tape. Just the cost alone scared me off. And also had read it can effect feel and rolling resistance, yada.
But speaking of cost, Vit Mastik apparently is scarce and my last $25.00 250gr can is ricing history.
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RCoapman
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 5141
Location: Back in the snowy homeland9/22/22 10:09 AM |
I read many reviews that said Effetto Mariposa tape was the gold standard. I found it very easy to install and followed all the recommendations on proper stretching of the tire (inflate to max and let sit for +24hrs), prep the surface, install tape, install tire and inflate to max for another 48hrs.
Not kept track but I'm sure I've probably put at least a thousand miles on them so far and they've felt and performed fantastic. No issues with the tape whatsoever. Not really doing any hard, crit-style cornering but I've bombed down some very fast curves at +45mph with zero problems.
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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19077
Location: PDX9/22/22 10:29 AM |
BTW, my XTR carbon tubulars are 26.4mm wide rims, slightly less gluing width. I started with 30mm tires.
Way difference experience gluing up these widths with so much more gluing area VS all my 18mm wide rim youth.. Those relfex mavic and earlier probably had 15-16mm gluing width.
I learned quickly after I mounted the first XTR staying a bit glue wet for popping on and alignment was imperative. Like right after the last rim coat, put on...
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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19077
Location: PDX9/22/22 2:21 PM |
If she had a tightish FreeHub, too heavy grease maybe... A sudden pedaling pause from 500 watts coulda whipped/threw the chain over the top I suppose.
All of a sudden all your weight over the front on such a stable bike...
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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 5100
Location: Nashua, NH9/22/22 3:15 PM |
"Then there's the Mt. Washington Auto Rd,, which they don't let you ride down on bikes, but has turnoffs and barrels of water to stop and cool down your car brakes. Not saying it's never been ridden down on bikes, just not on the right side of the law."
I beg your pardon...
I've ridden down Mt. Washington twice, on tubulars, and it was completely legal at the time. It wasn't allowed after the
sanctioned race,
but back then you could go there any time you wanted and ride it up and down for free.
That said, riding down it
really
sucks! Not only do you have the heat buildup problem, but your hands cramp and the rough surface beats the crap out of your wrists. Would I do it again? Assuming that I could actually haul myself up it, I would only consider descending it if I had disc brakes...and it was still legal to do so.
I love disc brakes for all the riding I do on dirt, but I don't need them for the road; I just don't ride anything extreme enough or ride in the rain.
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RCoapman
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 5141
Location: Back in the snowy homeland9/23/22 4:13 AM |
quote:
I just don't ride anything extreme enough or ride in the rain.
To my mind, brakes are like insurance- seems excessive and expensive until you need it. Sorry for the trite aphorism but I can't think of a non-corny way to say it.
I'm still riding rim brakes on my roadie but the gravel has disk and I greatly prefer the performance of the disk. Some say they are similar when dry and the real difference is in the wet but I notice a difference dry as well.
Because of that, and other reasons of course, when the new road bike gets here I'm unlikely to ride the Strong much anymore, at least not for the vast bulk of my training. I've found the disks to be so good they really inspire confidence in situations where I may need to brake hard, such as the anecdote I mentioned a few posts ago...though admittedly that was in some extreme wet where they really shine.
If nothing else, I feel they might give me a few extra feet of buffer in case of stupid drivers. Having had more than a few injurious and expensive encounters with 4-wheeled fucktards pulling in front of me at speed or stopping short, etc, in previous years I'll take whatever advantage I can get.
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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 5100
Location: Nashua, NH9/23/22 12:40 PM |
There's no doubt that discs offer superior braking, particularly in wet conditions. Now that the weight and cost differential is lower, when the time comes that I actually need a new road bike AND new wheels. I'll definitely consider discs. Barring some kind of disaster, that's not likely to happen anytime soon.
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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19077
Location: PDX9/23/22 5:41 PM |
quote:
when the time comes that I actually need a new road bike AND new wheels.
New, by then you may be hard pressed to find a non disc bike/frame etc. Just like in a few year a new car that is only naturally aspirated ICE may not be made. I digress...
The Boone flat mount hydro R8000 and even still old Gary 29er MTN Juicey Avids do have best lever feel.
Other disc setups I have run with cables and/or cable actuated hydro hybrids stop fine. Just not as nice lever feel.
About my fav brakes honestly are Pauls Mini-Moto on a Tomii CX canti frame/bike. But the R8000 Hydro are way up there. They all stop my fatness, else I embellish the system with some combination [if not full hydro] of Swiss stop green organic pads [front] and/or one or both polished stainless cables and compression-less housings.
Good polished cables top of that list. Logic seems that a short front length and not wanting an easily rear lock-up-able brake seem to make those housings moot. Based on 10 bikes of messing with setups.
Crated lake bike was TRP Hy/RD front and BB5 rear. No issues scrubbing/stopping. Just hot rotors. ;)
I am sure I have espoused all of this previously or parts here and there...
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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19077
Location: PDX9/24/22 8:38 AM |
quote:
I was actually thinking on this morning's ride that this may be the last high-end road bike I ever buy.
I think that after every/each procurement. ;) But not got a 'New' or Custom since Carl Built the green Allroad for me 2015. I still ride that a bunch too, ot went to Crater Lake 9/10. Pulled the Gravel 650b off for 700x30 tubulars, truely lives up to being an Allroad bike. Carl being early adopter kinda I guess.
quote:
since then I've bought a Domane RSL at 66 (a road bike), a Checkpoint at 67, and a G-Road where I'll take delivery at 72.
I just did up the 2020 Boone recently, I really been wanting exactly same RSL/SLR Domane as your SegaF Dan. I don't get new though, usually a mint 'pretty new' when a more wholesale offer I make times right and happens. Although I came close on the Dura Ace Di2 12k SegaF with tubs for 50% off in 2018.
So, Boone got and built after zippo finding RSL/RLR, and of course one popped up. And I even went lower on my offer, you know because it is his fault it was not for sale before I got the Boone Frame.
Anyway, though Boone might unseat the Classic Team Issue [2013] But is is really a CX bike and really shine on loose bumpy as it was designed to, 40mm tires fit helps..
But next Thur this Team Green [think Mads Pedersen's Green Jersey Madone] should land if on time. I actually have put ads up for the Classics...
I have all I need to Di2 R8000 it, except brakes.
I am honestly drawing a blank for bar tape. White is pretty but I am already tired of cleaning the Boone white tape after each ride. Cleaning once in a while I am OK with. ;)
Needless to say, IMO I have a few of Trek best RSL frames now, The Classics of course being the Original Race Shop beast.
Not intentionally being a Trek fanboy/bot. But I'd have a RSL/Emonda probably if the Extreme Power Nago wasn't so good. Plus RR geom is just not getting my use much any more...
But Green bar tape? Maybe Arundel GECKO PAVE.
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dan emery
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 6888
Location: Maine9/24/22 10:34 AM |
I don’t like cleaning tape either - I have black on my RSL and don’t recall cleaning it….ever….I think you have enough green, I’d lose the Ninja Turtle tape.
Enjoy the bike, it’s a good one.
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RCoapman
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 5141
Location: Back in the snowy homeland10/5/22 11:13 AM |
quote:
Keep us posted on the duty cost if you would.
No duty on Ekar shipment. Also ordered a travel box from BikeBoxAlan...also no duty. I have ordered stuff from overseas many times over the years and I think I've only paid duty one time out of however many dozens or hundreds of times.
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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19077
Location: PDX10/5/22 11:56 AM |
Ekar from bike24 was it?
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RCoapman
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 5141
Location: Back in the snowy homeland10/5/22 12:29 PM |
Yes, bike24. Shipped from Germany
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Nick Payne
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 2625
Location: Canberra, Australia10/5/22 8:28 PM |
quote:
but anyone see Van Vleutens front tubeless tire come off team TT World Championships?
Actually (I was only about 10m away at the time, but didn't have a view of the crash), the tyre came off because the really heavy impact of the front wheel into the kerb when she crashed broke the carbon fibre rim. You can clearly see that in this photo - the rim at about 4 o'clock is broken right through, and you can also see that the chain is on the small ring, whereas photos of her starting clearly show it on the big ring, so I'd say that the unexpected shift is what caused the crash:
A good thing the championships were a fortnight ago and not this week, as we're having a rain event of almost biblical proportions. It started raining yesterday morning, and isn't expected to stop until Monday. Sydney is about to exceed its previous record for annual rainfall, with about 85" recorded so far this year, and plenty more to come.
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RCoapman
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 5141
Location: Back in the snowy homeland10/16/22 2:47 PM |
Ekar
I find the chain angles quite hilarious, as well as the fact that the largest cog (and possibly the second largest) is larger in diameter than the brake disk. 44t front, 42-9 rear cassette.
<img src="https://i.imgur.com/Fvfdevr.jpg" width=750>
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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19077
Location: PDX10/16/22 4:13 PM |
The weight of these pie plates alone. ;)
Does the RD have a clutch?
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CYCLING TECH TALK FORUM
