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1.5 Trillion Infrastructure Shiny Ball
 

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 16693
Location: Portland, OR

2/13/18 12:49 PM

1.5 Trillion Infrastructure Shiny Ball

With 'only' [?] a 200 Billion actual Infrastructure ping pong ball floating in the center of said Shiny Ball.

Nothing up my sleeve, Presto/Chango. ;)

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daddy-o
Joined: 12 Apr 2004
Posts: 3201
Location: Springfield

2/13/18 3:57 PM

link?

(and resist borrowing trillions when the bond yield is .5% #sarcasm)

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 16693
Location: Portland, OR

2/13/18 5:17 PM

Google "200 billion going to infrastructure" and sift through the right and left fake news out there. ;)

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Craig
Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 548

2/13/18 7:50 PM

Canadian news source, relatively unbiased. Relatively.

https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2018/02/12/trump-unveils-44-trillion-budget-with-massive-deficit-increases.html

Tax revenue to decrease by $3.7trillion dollars over the next decade.

2019 deficit to be about $1 trillion, roughly double what Republicans promised it would be last year.

"The plan would put up $200 billion in federal money over the next 10 years to leverage $1.5 trillion in infrastructure spending, relying on state and local governments and the private sector to contribute the bulk of the funding.

Critics contend the infrastructure plan will fail to reach its goals without more federal support. Proposals to streamline the permitting process as a way to reduce the cost of projects have already generated opposition from environmental groups."

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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 4163
Location: Nashua, NH

2/14/18 6:28 AM

Yeah, it seems to be...

...just more "smoke and mirrors" from Trump. That's the kind way of saying "completely delusional thinking and disingenuous, deceptive and potentially destructive policy".

delusional...disingenuous...deceptive...destructive...Donald Hmmm.

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KerryIrons
Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 2927
Location: Midland, MI

2/14/18 10:22 AM

Simple plan

The essence of the plan is that the federal match will be somewhere between 12 and 14%. That's how a $200B federal program can "create" $1.5-1.7T in total spending. Only two problems with this:

1) states will have to come up with $1.3T-1.5T, either through new taxes, cutting other programs, or by getting private investment in toll roads, toll bridges, higher water/sewer rates, etc.

2) there is no source defined for the federal portion. This will have to come from hugely unpopular cuts to other federal programs.

What could possibly derail this "genius" plan?

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PLee
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 3606
Location: Brooklyn, NY

2/14/18 10:53 AM

Infrastructure work is needed and needs to be paid for.

At the end of the day, it will be the taxpayer/user that pays for it, regardless of whether the infrastructure project is a public or a public/private one.

Leveraging public money to raise private money is another instance of kicking the can down the road. And I can assure you that the private money will want a higher rate of return for their investment than public bond holders.

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 16693
Location: Portland, OR

2/14/18 1:57 PM

"Leveraging public money to raise private money is another instance of kicking the can down the road."

More obfuscation type 'get Mexico to pay for it later" methodology?

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walter
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 4360
Location: metro-motown-area

2/14/18 6:55 PM

sorry, brian...

...you voted for asshole-45 to support your "originalist" constitutional agenda, so you have to personally pay for all, as in 100%, of 45s ludicrous legislative agenda. no free passes, you voted, you pay for your vote. please bring your checkbook...credit-cards not accepted.

Last edited by walter on 2/16/18 12:25 PM; edited 1 time in total

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 16693
Location: Portland, OR

2/14/18 8:48 PM

Walter is on VaCa and the rum i think is loosening his tongue a bit.

Be nice now, and we all will have to pay for it, not just the voters that voted for DT.

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daddy-o
Joined: 12 Apr 2004
Posts: 3201
Location: Springfield

2/15/18 3:48 AM

The non-voters don't get a pass. That doesn't include suppressed votes.

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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6420
Location: Westchester/NYC

2/15/18 6:57 AM

“The non-voters don't get a pass. That doesn't include suppressed votes.”

Now we’re talking. Or rather, voting!

Although I didn’t vote for 45, I think the result is good for the people, of both sides.

1) for those who voted for him, they are forced to confront with the consequences of their choice

2) for those who didn’t vote, they’re forced to live with knowing their vote could have prevented this

3) for the vast majority who voted against him any way, will have to make sure to vote again come November.

This isn’t about just 45. It’s also all the senators and congressman on the lower half of their ballot.

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daddy-o
Joined: 12 Apr 2004
Posts: 3201
Location: Springfield

2/15/18 8:58 AM

"But the economy" argument.

But the lots-of-weird indicators evidence. What's this "inflation?" millennials ask. Bonds, metals, stocks rising, shelter and risk rise together? A 'treasury chief' willing to devalue the treasure. (and then take it back two days later. Man, the world jumped on THAT. Quick, hurry, we don't owe the U.S. so much today!)

I don't like being led by someone who integrates bankruptcy into their business strategy. This isn't measly Trump holdingz, a drop in the pool. This is the pool.

As for strict originalists, flexibility was originally built into the Constitution.

The well organized militia is certainly asserting its self, 36 mass shootings in 46 days of 2018. How's that for an originalist interpretation?

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Jesus Saves
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 1131
Location: South of Heaven

2/15/18 12:32 PM

"But the economy" argument.

You should ask "Brodirt" for his darned opinion. ;-)

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walter
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 4360
Location: metro-motown-area

2/15/18 1:57 PM

ha!

it was tequila, actually. ;-)

the point is still valid, if you voted for 45 it's not like a buffet dinner...you support *all* that is 45.

"you takes your choice" so you still need to "pays your money"

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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 4163
Location: Nashua, NH

2/16/18 7:58 AM

No Walter, not even close

How many people here have actually supported everything their preferred candidate/president proposed or did? I can honestly say that I have never supported everything carte blanche, even back in the Reagan days. While it's true that we all have to live with whatever transpires, that's a far cry from supporting it all. I have already expressed my opposition to many of Trump's/Congress' proposals and will continue to do so as necessary.

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daddy-o
Joined: 12 Apr 2004
Posts: 3201
Location: Springfield

2/16/18 9:35 AM

Including a direct statement, IIRC, everything presented so far indicates a vote based on one action,

A vote for someone held with complete contempt by the voter just so they can nominate a lifetime appointment, again statements as candidly repeated.

What seems to be the dizzying leap of faith is that the nominee would issue only laudable opinions.

A one issue vote defines contrast, no gray area, no scale, no balance.

HRC faced a nomination process demonstrated to be unified against even an immaculately qualified moderate. Her nomination would not have been her choice, so to speak.

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KerryIrons
Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 2927
Location: Midland, MI

2/16/18 10:36 AM

Confusion


quote:
sorry, kerry......you voted for asshole-45 to support your "originalist" constitutional agenda


Walter, you TOTALLY have me confused with someone else. You would be hard pressed to find a more anti-Trump partisan than me.

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walter
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 4360
Location: metro-motown-area

2/16/18 12:25 PM

sorry, kerry...meant brian!!! post corrected, my apologies.

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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 16693
Location: Portland, OR

2/16/18 1:17 PM

Walter, get a bloody mary in you...

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