6/21/15 6:29 PM

In another thread, I mentioned I'm contemplating taking up trail running. Well, I did, sort of. Last week, I ran... about 100 yard! :D

But boy, it felt sooooo good!!!

Stretching out my joints, firing up the muscles in coordination, and the feeling of ... oh, I don't know, just felt real good! That is, until my lungs went on strike, and my hearts threatened to jump out of my chest. So I stopped, walked a while, resume running. But it didn't feel half as strong as the first 100 yard, and never quite get my stride back.

Bit of background. I was in the track team back in high school. I started out as a sprinter but didn't do too great. I had some speed, just not enough to be much good. So I was switched (by my coach) to 1/4 mile and 1/2 mile. I didn't do too well there either, not in terms of placing on the podium. That's when I stopped running for speed competition and went on to competitive badminton.

As part of training exercise, I ran, typically 1/4-1/2 miles, maybe up to a mile. That's it. I never really learn how to breath in a sustained run. So it was always a sprint followed by a slow trot, till I dragged my sorry butt to the finish while my lung felt like it's on fire. It was always my lung/heart that gave out before my muscles did.

So the moment I stopped competitive sport (college), I stopped running. I only run to catch the bus these days. Though to be frank, I always feel pretty darn good every time there's a bus to catch!

I think I have a pretty decent stride. But it's probably more of a sprinter's gait rather than a marathon runner's gait. Good for speed, not necessarily the most efficient.

I need to find a good source of information on how to "work" on my endurance. Seems my cardio capacity from cycling didn't quite transfer to running. Maybe also some modification to my stride technique more suitable for distance running. I'd like to be able to run a little longer than 100 yards!!!

I'm not running on pavement though. Trails, with occasional rocks and roots that I need to hop over.

Where do I start???

6/21/15 10:17 PM

I run 80% trails, typically 2x a week during the colder months, up to 1.5 hours.

No running background to speak of, except for a brief year on the indoor relay team in Grade 7. I caught the cycling bug early and never had any incentive to run.

I have found that my cardio does cross over to running, and that it is the knees/joints that are my limiting factor. Consequently, I've had to adjust my form considerably to be able to keep running.

I think you are smart to look into your gait and would suggest taking a look at Chi Running or Pose Running. These running techniques typically share the same principles emphasizing running economy: high cadence (180 steps per minute), forward lean (not bending at the waist), mid- or fore-foot strike, landing with feet below (not in front of) you.

Regarding endurance, my suggestion is to increase gradually to avoid injury, the typical suggestion is no more than 10% weekly. It takes time to build up the muscles in your joints. Trail running is great for building up ankle strength and agility.

My number one recommendation with trail running is to remember to always pick up your ankles, especially on technical sections and toward the end of runs when you get tired. Yes, faceplants can and do happen.

6/22/15 8:02 AM

The key to endurance running is pacing yourself, learned only after much repetition. It sounds to me like you're still sprinting too fast out of the gate and burning yourself out. Try a slow jog to start - sustain it for about five minutes before you try to ramp it up. Start with no more than a total of a quarter mile and slowly increase your mileage.

6/22/15 9:06 AM

Definitely start out on a run/walk repeat program...PLee is right - go slower and extend your running time to a couple minutes, then walk a minute and repeat. You'll be discovering all sorts of new muscles along the way so pay attention to that, but don't be afraid of getting back out there even if you are a bit sore from your last run. As often as every other day will be good for a few weeks...and then you can do back to back days if you are up for it...

Keep us posted!

6/22/15 9:33 AM

What sanrensho said. Walk/run/walk if you have to. Trails are actually easier on the knees, as they're not as repetitive, but I know you're in NYC.

If you do run trails, yeah, be careful, I've faceplanted more than once, but I have some proprioception issues lingering from a spinal cord injury. I'd also avoid sunglasses, for some reason I'm more prone to faceplants with them on.

6/22/15 10:29 AM

As someone who types for a living you might want to wear cycling gloves on the trail. Everyone I talk to, and my experience indicates a 100% chance of falling.

I second the walk-run introduction. My brother had several attempts at restarting his running halted by shin splints from his college days. He was a super fast walker, hiked NY Adirondacks all the time, couldn't run. I told him run a hundred yards every walk/hike this week, 200 next week, etc. A year later in his mid-50s he ran a half marathon and never had a hint of shin splints. Best wishes.

6/23/15 7:57 AM

April - I moved from cycling to running in 2007, and have been running marathons since 2009. As others said, the beginning is slow and somewhat discouraging, but if you keep at it, the change from walk / run to running 5k isn`t that long.
What I want to stress is the importance of a suitable shoe. Depending on your stride, whether your foot goes in or out, heel or forefoot landing all influence the choice of shoe, and the wrong shoe can be the source of anything from discomfort to injury. The same way you wouldn`t buy a bike without it being fitted properly, the same holds true for a running shoe..Best of luck !

6/23/15 11:38 AM

Running group get together.

"I am getting over this or that injury, my right dealy bop hurts, my knee looks like a basket ball, I can't walk when I get up in the morning because my feet hurt really bad."

Cycling group ride.

Check out my new "Super Bike with the carbon screw bolts and aero nose guard" Let's all go ride fast then drink coffee and beer."


I run, but very little. Running ruins your body in a hurry unless you weigh 3 kilos.

6/23/15 1:58 PM

Erik is exactly right.

Runner's forum: "My knees hurt..." "I have plantar fasciitis..." "I have shin splints..." "My doctor says I should stop running..." "I am out x weeks with a stress fracture..."

Cycling forum: "Rapha is the best..." "Rapha sucks." And gear-related posts.

With running, I find that it is crucial to keep running regularly. Taking more than a week or so off can be excruciating on the first run back. Based on my sample of one. Cycling is what runners do when they are injured...which seems to be often.

I do love the simplicity of just strapping on a watch, putting on shoes, and going out the door for a run.

6/23/15 3:48 PM

I don't even bother with a watch . . .

6/23/15 3:59 PM

GPS watch...I like to keep track of my weekly hours exercised and pace.

6/23/15 4:07 PM

Highly recommend reading Born to Run, it will change the way you look at shoes (and running). I can no longer run in anything more than 8 mm drop shoes. (Prefer zero or 4 mm.)

6/24/15 8:19 PM

Thanks everyone! :D

I'll take it slowly... (I don't think my 100 yard dash counts as a proper "run")

quote:

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The same way you wouldn`t buy a bike without it being fitted properly, the same holds true for a running shoe..Best of luck!

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6/25/15 2:26 AM

Most good running stores will have a treadmill (sometimes with a video camera) and someone knowledgeable enough offer a gait analysis. That can at least help in choosing a neutral, support, or motion shoe. Also they can see if you land on your heel or front of foot which will help determine cushioning. Like myself, you are small, so don`t need a bulky, over cushioned shoe, which will only add unnecessary weight. Unfortunately, heel - toe drop is preference, and comes with experience. Most shoes are 8 -11 mm, but those that prefer a barefoot approach will get down to almost 0.
To get a better idea, go into runningwarehouse.com which is not only an excellent online store, but offer explanations as well as gait analysis if you send them a video.

6/25/15 2:28 AM

Running shoe stores usually have a treadmill and a video camera. They'll tell you if you need stability or are neutral etc. (I'm neutral.)

After a while, you can tell by the wear pattern on your shoes.

You should learn to run with proper form to avoid injuries. Rick Hardy is on this forum.

I did a 10 mile (sorta hilly) trail run loop recently. The initial uphill was nasty but the reward of a gentle downhill was wonderful. And a (slow) half-marathon on an indoor treadmill. I used trail running shoes (Salomon) for the former and Newton shoes for the latter. You learn to use the right shoe. The treadmill is easier on your knees than concrete or tarmac, so you can use older shoes.

On the road, I've only ever done marathon events. I'm scared to do half-marathons.

6/25/15 8:00 AM

All these tslk of marathon scares me. I don't need another addiction!

6/25/15 8:10 AM

From someone who has ran competitively since the age of 10, my best advice to you is to start real slow and to listen to your body. Even as a veteran runner, on rare occasion, like now, I am guilty to not heading such advice. I'm currently laid up with a stress fracture. It's my 1st - hard for me to admit I'm getting old.

In the beginning it is best to mix in jogging with walking. Be real patient with your buildup. Your aerobic fitness from cycling is way ahead of your body's physical adaption to the stress (pounding) of running. That will make you more susceptible to physical injury whereby your legs will give out before your heart does. The opposite is true for someone just starting an exercise routine and they are more likely to quit due to mental "injury" (discouragement/stress/burnout).

6/25/15 8:51 AM

Start out learning to run correctly.

Low flat shoes, midfoot strike, and short distances. Your calves will hurt at first but take it slow. Your knees and shins will thank you in the long run.

Highly padded shoes will let you run incorrectly and get away with it for a while. Don't get sucked into them because soft shoes feel nice.

I have settled on Nike FlyKnit 4.0, they are a great combo of road feel and protection.

6/25/15 2:25 PM

quote:

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All these tslk of marathon scares me. I don't need another addiction!

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6/25/15 2:39 PM

quote:

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Your aerobic fitness from cycling is way ahead of your body's physical adaption to the stress (pounding) of running. That will make you more susceptible to physical injury whereby your legs will give out before your heart does. The opposite is true for someone just starting an exercise routine and they are more likely to quit due to mental "injury" (discouragement/stress/burnout).

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6/25/15 9:11 PM

I'm going to differ a little with advice. I do agree with the start slow and easy and work up the time/distance. Having a track background or just being a natural sprinter always makes it tough to start - the tendency is start way too fast. Just avoid that and go slow and alternate walking and running if necessary. Keep this up until you can jog five minutes at a time. Then gradually add more until it becomes easy.

I wouldn't worry about getting the perfect shoes right away. Until you are doing more than a couple miles, just about any decent shoes work.

6/25/15 10:07 PM

http://recoveryourstride.blogspot.com/2009/05/kickbiking-in-running-times-magazine.html

https://www.kickbikeamerica.com/mrktng/why.html

I truly empathize with your recent trepidations toward cycling, and hate to see you condemn yourself to a sentence of hard labor (running.) A kickbike offers all the benefits of both cycling and running with none of the downsides. Also has elements of XC skiing, even rowing. No more shin splints, saddle soreness or chain tattoos.

Maybe it's biggest benefit is that the body is not clamped into--or onto--the vehicle. If need be, the rider can hop off and free of the bike. No more excuses for rolling through intersections; just step off, step back on.

Your range on a kickbike won't approach that of a bicycle, but it's a lot faster than running the same number of miles, a lot less painful and lots more fun. I've been kicking asphalt since 2003 and I'm still crazy about this vigorous, exuberant - yet graceful - form of travel.

6/26/15 6:30 AM

Kick bike doesn't appeal.

I'm not biking for exercise. I bike to get to places. So range is super important.

Running is more for getting into thee woods since I stop mountain biking...

Moreover, it looks to me it's pretty hard on the knee. That squtting motion sends pain throught my IT band just thinking about it!

6/27/15 8:39 PM

Skiing ! = running and you are running too fast if your lungs are the limiter. You can choose to accept the advice given or choose to learn the hardway. ...