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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6593
Location: Westchester/NYC6/23/13 3:04 PM |
Need help -- Campy shifter cable replacement problem
Something cut my hand while riding. Upon close inspection, I realized the shifter cable had frayed at the shifter and it's the freyed cable end that's poking through...
So I got a new cable and pull the old ones off the derailleur and started feeding it through towards the shifter. But the cable head wouldn't come out cleanly ...
It seems the cable had frayed just shy of the little bolck with the hole (where the cable head sits).
Now the little frayed end refuse to fit smoothly through the hole and the head wouldn't come out of its resting place. I tried to push on the partial cable. I can see the head come out maybe 1/3 of the head height (I have the new cable to compare how long the head is) but no more...
There's not enough of the head for me to grap it with the pliers I have (kind of big one). But I'm not sure even if I get a smaller plier, there's enough of the head to grip on... especially to pull through against the resistance of the unruly strands of frayed cable on the other side of the hole...
I remember repeated mentioning of Campy cable heads not coming out free, though usually due to having the wrong cable with a too big head. (this one seems to be free to move around the recess space, except there's not enough leverage to "pop" the head clean out of it!) I don't remember any of the remedies to solve the problem of jammed cable heads. Still, wondering if any one of those remedy would work in my situation? Or any other suggestions I could try?
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ErikS
Joined: 19 May 2005
Posts: 8337
Location: Slowing boiling over in the steamy south, Global Warming is real6/23/13 3:12 PM |
Letting cables go this long often mean the end for the shifter itself. I have spent hours fishing a cable end out of a Shimano shifter myself. Almost spent a few hundred on new shifters. Now I swap the right cable at least twice a year on my bike.
Good luck. It is not an easy fix.
Get needle nose vise grips and clamp down like an SOB on the end and pull out. Other than that you have to break out the CC.
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Andy M-S
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 3377
Location: Hamden (greater New Haven) CT6/23/13 3:26 PM |
I wouldn't give up yet...
Get some long, narrow needle-nose pliers, no need for vise grips (I suspect). Push the head out as far as you can, then get in there and grab it with the needle-nose and yank. Bet it comes right out.
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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6593
Location: Westchester/NYC6/23/13 4:28 PM |
Alright, I'll try with the needle nose plier I have (it's in my apartment in New York, which I'll visit midweek). Will report back if it works. I'm a little skeptical because the amount of material "standing out" looks to be borderline for even the needle nose. But until I put the plier next to the head, I won't be able to make a honest accessment.
(this is my "secondary" bike so time is not quiite as critical)
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greglepore
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 1724
Location: SE Pa, USA6/23/13 4:33 PM |
Hemostats are your friend....
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dan emery
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 6897
Location: Maine6/23/13 4:55 PM |
Hate that!
I've had exactly the same problem, impaled my finger on the damn frayed strands. Can't help with the solution, I fiddled a bit with the vice grips and cable cutter, then took it to the LBS (but that's a different thread).
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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6593
Location: Westchester/NYC6/23/13 5:29 PM |
quote:
I fiddled a bit with the vice grips and cable cutter, then took it to the LBS (but that's a different thread).
That's always an option. But I'd like to take another crack at it before giving in.
The head poking out just a bit on every push taunting me in a strange way. It became a challenge, a bit like a super steep driveway in the neighborhood, many a rider would want to at least attempt it a couple times before conceding defeat.
In this case, there's real result to be achieved. Looking for that satisfaction.
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dfcas
Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 2816
Location: hillbilly heaven6/23/13 6:14 PM |
If and when you get the old one out, put a little grease on the ball head of the new one. I once had to drill out an old one. Not fun.
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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 5102
Location: Nashua, NH6/24/13 4:51 AM |
It may be easier to grab the head...
...with a pair of wire cutters (or plier-style toenail clippers), since they'll bite into the soft head material on the sides. Before you try to pull the head out, cut off the cable as close to the head as possible and remove any loose strands.
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greglepore
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 1724
Location: SE Pa, USA6/24/13 5:33 AM |
I've resorted to the drill as well. I've taken to grinding down the OD of "universal" cables for Campy use, and greasing them well.
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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6593
Location: Westchester/NYC6/24/13 7:47 AM |
quote:
Before you try to pull the head out, cut off the cable as close to the head as possible and remove any loose strands.
I considered that. But the loose strands were already so close to the block that I can't get any cutting device in there to cut more.
Though now that you mention nail clipper, I MIGHT be able to get one in close. I'll take another look when I get home. I think if I can cut off the unruly frayed strands, the head might just come out with a little push from what's left of the cable.
Unfortunately, it's going to be so hot the next few days the garage is going to be like an oven! Not the best place to work when a cool head is required.
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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 5102
Location: Nashua, NH6/25/13 4:49 AM |
Cut and unwind
If you can't cut the cable close to the lug, cut it an inch or so farther back, then unwind all of the broken strands from the cut end of the cable. That will leave you with something to push with, but you won't have any broken ends facing the lug and preventing the head from being pushed out
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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6593
Location: Westchester/NYC6/25/13 7:46 AM |
Nah, won't do much good to cut more. It's already pretty close to the end that I can't put anything in there to cut.
Hope the needle nose plier will do the trick. Or it's going to the bike shop. (I'd be curious what they could do though. This isn't like something that requires a bike specific tool that I don't have...)
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greglepore
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 1724
Location: SE Pa, USA6/25/13 8:11 AM |
They'll likely either get it with something like a hemostat or failing that take the shifter off and drill it out-in not hard, just requires patience and a small bit.
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Craig
Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 592
6/25/13 1:53 PM |
If you can push it out far enough to get pliers on it you can probably stick something sharp into the side of it and pull it out that way. Steak knife, exacto knife, small bladed screwdriver, and gently pry it out. "gently" is the key word there. Pliers can work against you.
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Brian Nystrom
Joined: 26 Jan 2004
Posts: 5102
Location: Nashua, NH6/26/13 5:17 AM |
Good point Craig
You need something that will dig into the head enough to get a bite on it.
Greg, I don't see how drilling would be of any use. According to April, the head of the cable moves, so attempting to drill it would be an exercise in frustration, since it's just going to spin.
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greglepore
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 1724
Location: SE Pa, USA6/27/13 5:59 AM |
someone emailed me a tip to try a dental pick, many hardware stores/harbor freight etc have them...
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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6593
Location: Westchester/NYC6/27/13 7:58 AM |
Lots of good ideas. I'll tackle it this weekend and report back
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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19099
Location: PDX6/27/13 9:20 AM |
Sears / K-Mart in the tools section has a set of rubber handled steel pic/probes, sez made is US too. Labled 'Small Pic Set' see picture below
I have used these changing out brake cables without un/re-wrapping bars many times. there is a combination of hooked and various twisted tips I find useful for such tasks. Machinist scribes also have a variety of useful scribes with different hooked and bent tips good for this as well.
NewEgg has these:
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PLee
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 3713
Location: Brooklyn, NY6/27/13 12:12 PM |
Excellent! I've been looking for something like that to pick paint out of an old door that I'm restoring.
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Sparky
Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 19099
Location: PDX6/27/13 12:19 PM |
These are good for, especially the loop one, for loose ball bearing wheel rebuilds. Both for plucking the errant balls from the middle of the hub, and placing the cleaned or new one into the hub packed with grease.
I use them for a lot of guitar tasks. Grabbing springs, ever try to replace rear derailleur spring? Opening up the ends of a cable housing liner after cutting. etc., to the ^10.
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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6593
Location: Westchester/NYC6/28/13 6:06 PM |
SUCCESS!!!
It was more of a challenge than I thought.
Collecting all the suggestions offered by you all, I came home armed with the following:
http://forums.alpinezone.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=9028&d=1372464013
(actually, a lot of them to choose from out of the make-up kit of a household of two women!)
Today was a light day at work. I got home early. Since the day was young and temperature had moderated enough the garage is no longer an oven, I couldn't resist so got to work immediately...
But 10 minutes later, I was no closer to getting it out than before. The problem, as I could see, was the extra resistance of those unruly strand from the frayed end of the cable.
The head was only sticking out less than 1mm. Much too little to get a solid grip on with any of the tools I had. And I was a bit worried about rounding off what little of the head that's sticking out. The combination of high resistance and lack of good grip was what prevented me before. I began to consider the possibility of conceeding defeat and take the bike to a shop...
Standing back to collect myself, that's when I noticed the head was now out more than a full 1mm while before was less than that. So, I actually made a tiny bits of progress! That was encouraging for me to get back to work...
Knowing I merely need to work patiently to eventually get it out, I re-arranged my work area and my posture so I don't get tired and knock things over by mistake. Another 5 minutes later, the head was out maybe 1.5mm but then refused to budge the next 5 minutes!
Frustrated but not discouraged, I decided to rotate the head... in an "un-screw" motion. Within about 30 second, half of the head was visible! Haha!
The rest was easy. The whole process actually took about 1/2 hr. Was it worth it? Probably break even compare to the time it would take for me to bring it to the shop and then go back to pick it up.
Thank you all for all the suggestions. I actually "enjoy" the process. I hope some of you too enjoy the mental exercise as well, or at least found some entertainment value?
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Dave B
Joined: 10 Jan 2004
Posts: 4511
Location: Pittsburgh, PA6/28/13 7:20 PM |
Caution
Now that the broken cable head is out, is there any possibility that someone installed a Shimano compatible cable in your Campy brifter?
Shimano shift cables have an end barrel that's slightly larger in diameter than a Campy cable. You can install a Shimano cable but will have a very hard time removing it once the end fitting is jammed in the brifter. Be VERY sure you install the correct new cable or file a Shimano cable down to the correct diameter.
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April
Joined: 13 Dec 2003
Posts: 6593
Location: Westchester/NYC6/28/13 7:42 PM |
It's not the cable head that's broken. It's a frayed cable.
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ErikS
Joined: 19 May 2005
Posts: 8337
Location: Slowing boiling over in the steamy south, Global Warming is real6/29/13 5:51 AM |
He is referring to the replacement cable and next time.
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